Difference between TV3D and 3DGS

[Chrono]

What is the difference between Truevision3d and 3D gamestudio? I'm not that good with engines (meaning of it) and I was wondering how would I use it? I know C-Script but. What about modeling and placement?

[GoodVillain]

The problem with 3DGS is it babies your game development knowledge. No offense to you as I am not trying to put you down. But unlike 3DGS this is a real developers 3D engine. Map editors and such are included with 3DGS killing the creative development of the game. Map editors ect must be custom coded or you can download some of the editors some of the community members made. This isnt a bad thing, it allows you to have no limitations to your editors unlike the 3DGS editors.

I know 6.2 probly wont work with C. I dont know with 6.5. It does work with C++, any .NET lanuage, Visual Basic, and some others.

Find a compiler that works with it, install the full sdk, and play with the examples. Anymore needed help can be reach via the boards, TVDN, or IRC chat rooms.

[BlindSide]

C-Script is pseudo-interpereted, and is used only by 3DGS. It's syntax is similar to C++, but thats about it.

If your going to use TV, you'll need to learn how to program in either VB, C++, C#, Delphi, or any other ALT/COM or Managed lang (.net). Don't look at this as something bad though, it doesn't take much to learn something like VB, or if you can already use C-Script C++ isn't too much of a leap.

Besides, if your serious about game (or application, for that matter) development, eventually your going to need to move on to real programming anyway. Might as well start now, and use TV

Oh, and 3DGS (which I've been using since v5.10) cannot match TV 6.5 in terms of speed, features, ease of use, or support (though support is good). And, along with the release of 6.5 there are going to be a few decent user-made editors arriving on the scene.

For modeling, TV 6.2 will load 3ds, x and md2 files. TV 6.5 will have it's own internal format, but provides convertors for the afformentioned types. Trust me, you have a lot more freedom with mapping/models with TV than 3DGS. Your not limited to BSP (though you can use them), you can make your entire level out of models (like x files) if you wanted, or use TV's amazingly fast terrain;  or even a combination of all 3.

[Chrono]

But the thing is. I've checked out show case. And all i've seen was landscapes. Those are the best I've ever seen in gamewise. But I do not see any models or game characters or anything like that.

[AriusMyst]

But the thing is. I've checked out show case. And all i've seen was landscapes. Those are the best I've ever seen in gamewise. But I do not see any models or game characters or anything like that.

Check the screenshots of the stuff on the site in my sig...

Edit: An also, the lack of shots of models is down to artwork, not code or capabilities.

[BlindSide]

Models and game characters are all artistic assets, they have very little to do with the engine itself. If you can model and texture a great character, TV can render it for you.

6.5 supports normal mapping, shaders, AND includes an automatic high poly -> low poly normal map generator; if thats what your looking for.

[Chrono]

well what I've seen out of those screenshots..... You guys have pure talent in modeling.... Is it possible to use the modeling program and the C-Script program with this program? So I will be bale to make the models and script with ease then import here for the nice renders?

[BlindSide]

TV isn't a program, it's an engine. Therein lies the fundemental difference between TV and 3DGS.

C-Script is a scripting lang, and as such it'll only work with 3DGS. Your going to have to learn programming to use TV, but like I said before, this is a good thing. You'll never want to use C-Script again.

As far as the modeling program in concerned.. thats a yes and no. 3DGS uses its own model format, so you wouldn't be able to use models created with its modeler directly. However, if you could find a convertor, then your set.

TV, instead of forcing you to use one file type (for 6.2) supports X, MD2, MD3, 3DS, and others. 6.5 has it's own format, but comes with a whole slew of convertors for modeling programs and files (max, maya, .map files, etc).

[Omnigames]

Personally, I just don't like C-Script. It's supposed to be very similar to JavaScript but is so in syntax only. Plus, it's missing some pretty important aspects of linear programming; for example, there's no SWITCH statement (or its equivalent), forcing programmers to write copious IF-THEN statements. Supposedly, there's a much improved scripting language coming which is closer to C++ but that's yet to happen.

Probably the best aspect of 3DGS is its ability to quickly prototype game ideas and see them in action. But once you're finished prototyping, I'd use TV3D (or maybe Cipher) to do the actual development. It's more complex and will take longer than with 3DGS but you'll have MUCH more control over what happens in your game if you do it the "hard" way.

[AriusMyst]

Personally, I just don't like C-Script. It's supposed to be very similar to JavaScript but is so in syntax only. Plus, it's missing some pretty important aspects of linear programming; for example, there's no SWITCH statement (or its equivalent), forcing programmers to write copious IF-THEN statements. Supposedly, there's a much improved scripting language coming which is closer to C++ but that's yet to happen.

Probably the best aspect of 3DGS is its ability to quickly prototype game ideas and see them in action. But once you're finished prototyping, I'd use TV3D (or maybe Cipher) to do the actual development. It's more complex and will take longer than with 3DGS but you'll have MUCH more control over what happens in your game if you do it the "hard" way.

Welcome to the board  

[bluefire2]

Post Deleted (changed my mind)

[AriusMyst]

I  really like 3dGS for a number of reasons, but the lack of freedom is really what kills it for me. And after trying out Artificial Studio's game engine (Reality Engine) I don't think I can ever really go back to 3dGS, TV6.5 looks like it might be just what I'm looking for.

(you may find conflicting posts by me on other forums, but thats only because I'm a suck up)

Welcome to the board  

An trust me, 6.5 is amazing.

[GoodVillain]

C-Script is a scripting lang, and as such it'll only work with 3DGS. Your going to have to learn programming to use TV, but like I said before, this is a good thing. You'll never want to use C-Script again.

You can also use programming languages for almost anything which is something C script cant do. If you wanted to go look for a programming job youll have a higher chance of getting hired if you know real programming languages. The last thing they would want is a guy that can only do C script. Its useless to them unless there program uses it which is doubtful.

Your C script knowledge is good though, as it will help you learn other languages faster and easier since you have had a little exposure.

[Omnigames]

Here are my opinions on some different engines compared to TV3D...

=== 3D GameStudio ===
Pros:
+ Great for prototyping and quick development of a game concept.
+ Integrated modeler and level designer.
+ Strong community support.

Cons:
- C-Script is a very weird language to get used to.
- You can use C++ (or maybe C#) by building your own DLL(s) but that's cumbersome and can lead to performance issues.

=== Cipher ===
Pros:
+ Engine completely written in C++.
+ All source code is included, making it "easy" to do things the way you want.
+ Good SDK documentation (but only for objects, properties and methods -- see below).
+ Issues are usually addressed by the chief programmer.
+ Very nice shader and particle system designer.

Cons:
- Not much in the way of how-to samples or documentation; you're pretty much on your own when it comes to your game.

=== DarkBasic ===
Pros:
+ Lots of shader and bumpmapping effects.
+ Lots of samples and examples. (I was able to build an aspect of my game in only 15 minutes by using the included sample code!)

Cons:
- Very buggy. (It's always a "work in progress".)

=== Torque ===
Pros:
+ Complete engine; all aspects of game development are addressed.
+ Lots of community support; frequent updates. (There is even a book "3D Game Programming All in One", which takes you step-by-step through writing your own game.)

Cons:
- Although you don't have to use the included scripting language, Torque recommends it for "proper" game development. However, the scripting language is interpreted, not compiled.
- Geared toward FPS games (although you can write just about any type of game with it).



I may update this more when I have time, but these are the basic reasons I've chosen to use TrueVision. In short, I simply like the way TV3D works! I want to use C# (which I think is the best language ever -- but that's an entire debate unto itself!) but don't want to deal with DLLs. TV3D seems to have everything I need in one package without being bloated or lacking. I'm very much looking forward to version 6.5.