Dead_Zone
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« on: May 14, 2006, 07:29:20 PM » |
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i figured i'd post some VS screenies here..you decide which engine is better lol and theres nothing special added in these both projects were made with the exact same specifications DarkBasic TrueVision3D the lighting i set in truevision isnt exactly right..i had Zaknefeins help i still have to tweak it more..but this alone should be good enough for comparison |
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Wazoo
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« Reply #1 on: May 14, 2006, 07:38:13 PM » |
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This is one of the most biased comparisons i've ever seen.
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----------------------------------------------------------
There are only 2 types of people in the world.
Those that think they are smart and those that aren't.
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Dead_Zone
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« Reply #2 on: May 14, 2006, 07:53:57 PM » |
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how is this comparison biased?
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rootsage
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« Reply #3 on: May 14, 2006, 09:08:15 PM » |
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Well I have used DB before and it is alright. But pretending I had never used it  I wouldn't be able to judge the engines based on those screen shots. imo they are very similar and lack the power of both engines, they are just so basic of screen shots and lighting isn't the only factor that defines a good engine. But having knowledge of both DB and TV3D, I say TV3D wins. TV3D is so much easier for me to use, both to create tools and games  . -Eric |
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"We would change the world, but God won't give us the source code..."
"Windows is a set of 32 bit extensions on a 16 bit shell for an 8 bit OS using a 4 bit kernel made by a 2 bit company that can't stand 1 bit of competition"
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Dead_Zone
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« Reply #4 on: May 14, 2006, 09:48:18 PM » |
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lol @ ur quote
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rootsage
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« Reply #5 on: May 14, 2006, 10:56:45 PM » |
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"We would change the world, but God won't give us the source code..."
"Windows is a set of 32 bit extensions on a 16 bit shell for an 8 bit OS using a 4 bit kernel made by a 2 bit company that can't stand 1 bit of competition"
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Zaknafein
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« Reply #6 on: May 14, 2006, 11:10:28 PM » |
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That's a bit ridiculous. Both DBPro and TV3D can do alot better than that. It's like comparing Valve's Source and Epic's Unreal3 Engine by putting a teapot in a skybox and checking which renders best... The only difference I see is that your lighting is poorly set up in TV3D, the skybox is poorly set up in DBPro, and there's about 100FPS more in TV3D (which makes sense ). |
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Dead_Zone
Community Member
Posts: 30
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« Reply #7 on: May 15, 2006, 06:20:11 AM » |
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i havent changed the lighting since we were fixing it that day and yeah i know thats NOT dark basics best but it really cant do much better and both of those demos have the same textures models and everything no media difference my test was to merely see which one could handle more on screen and which looked better..and mesh loading in truevision is better look at the liger zero..doesnt he seem squished to you? and im just showing how the rendering is and as for the skybox..what? you want me to scale it bigger? thats as good as it'll get TV3D beats dark basic by far..you guys just didnt get what i was trying to show
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Red Ocktober
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« Reply #8 on: September 21, 2006, 10:00:00 AM » |
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ok... ignoring the pics above... my opinion of DBPro is a positive one in the sense of the dev team their, and the guy who is the prime mover and shaker over at The Game Creators... i think they are above board first rate guys... and for me, the people you choose to assoicate with are important...
that said, it is with great pain that in all honesty, i would not really put DBpro on the same level as TV3D... the reasons are as follows...
1- OOP... without it, all i will ever be able to make is a demo, or a small, non complicated game... DBPro, Blitz3D, all traditional BASIC based languages fall into this same category as i see it... now i know someone will jump up and tell me that Carmack did Quake in c, and that's not OOP... well, let em look at the code and follow it for any extent...
2- a lot of the api is buggy... sorry, there are still quite a few faults ...
3- every update will break all of the addon packs that are available... but in all honesty, they do try and update em rather quickly...
4- the shader situation there is a mess... in spite of some decent implementations by a few talented people over there, applying the wiz bang dx9 shaders is a real pain... and the built in ones don't seem to recognize fog at all...
there's more... but i'm sorry... i'd never consider starting a game project in DBPro...
i really tried to like it, but it's not for me...
--Mike
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micmanos
Customers
Community Member
Posts: 367
End of this evil world in 4..3..2..
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« Reply #9 on: September 21, 2006, 11:09:39 AM » |
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This comparison attempt looks similar to some childish attempts of mine to measure the performance of 2 computers simply by running a FOR - NEXT loop and see which one is faster ... :lol:
I agree with Zak.
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The limited human life is much like a powerful locomotive assigned to carry a handful of sand over a distance of a few millimeters. Logic dictates that human beings are not meant to die. So what went wrong?
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guppy
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« Reply #10 on: October 24, 2006, 06:46:03 PM » |
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I've played some games made with dark basic. They're almost rather slow.probably because of interpreter.
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seppuku arts
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« Reply #11 on: October 29, 2006, 05:21:07 PM » |
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Dark Basic Pro is a very good engine which is getting better and better, with its current build things have sped up quite a bit and using the right shadow codes can give good performance, its shader capabilities are quite high now, I am currently using it for the TGC nVidia competition, I have almost coded the engine, I just need to fix my Cinema 4D direct x issues so my models will be animated. I think it is like TV3D in a sense but obviously with its own basic based language and has some of its limitations in comparison, but TV3D costs more, for the price you pay it is very good, considering you can get a good commercial quality game if you're dedicated enough to do one. I found knowing DBP has gotten me started in the game making world quite nicely, as I am using TV3D and Torque alongside it. What I've got in my game in it so far ('scuse the lack of animation, Cinema 4D is being a pain with the Direct X file format)    Considering my computer isn't very good, for what is there the frame rate isn't too bad. Scene stats: High poly model - 1.5k or more polies, double in tris Shaders - Per Pixel Lighting, Shader based Shadows, Animated reflective and refractive water (Not seen in the screens, but they are being rendered Hi-res textures |
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Rynus_Rein
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« Reply #12 on: October 30, 2006, 03:47:22 AM » |
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I hope the crappy edges are caused by the JPEG compression of the screenshots?
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Rynus Rein
Current Project: MapX Live, Society3D
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seppuku arts
Community Member
Posts: 49
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« Reply #13 on: October 30, 2006, 07:22:57 AM » |
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they are, paint is pretty bad for saving jpgs.
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darqSHADOW
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« Reply #14 on: October 30, 2006, 10:25:39 AM » |
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Scene stats:
High poly model - 1.5k or more polies, double in tris
Shaders - Per Pixel Lighting, Shader based Shadows, Animated reflective and refractive water (Not seen in the screens, but they are being rendered
Hi-res textures Ouch, and the FPS is in the 20's? What hardware is this run on? DS |
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TrueVision3D Project Manager
The fast and simple way of 3D development.
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eloadrin
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« Reply #15 on: October 30, 2006, 10:48:34 AM » |
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Scene stats:
High poly model - 1.5k or more polies, double in tris
Shaders - Per Pixel Lighting, Shader based Shadows, Animated reflective and refractive water (Not seen in the screens, but they are being rendered
Hi-res textures
I'll be really honest, if you say that is supposed to be a high poly model, at about 1.5k or more, it shouldn't be. The model isn't that high quality, almost no detail, you could reduce the amount of poly's by quite a bit and keep the same look. It would also help in your FPS count, considering that you say you have average/low hardware. Also, Dark Basic Pro is a game suite made for people starting out wanting to make games, who have absolutely no programming experience. You can not really compare this to TV3D. It really isn't that flexible, and it's all script. It's not something you would really want to go with to release commercial products, IMO anyways. It's basically game maker gone 3d. And once again, you still can't really compare a game engine, with a graphics engine. Sure you can make games with TV3d, but you still have to code your own "game" engine, and use TV3d as your renderer. It has no built in features for games specifically, like game states etc. And as it goes for price, to be honest, price doesn't tell you if an engine is good or not. What really tells you if an engine is good is it's functionality and potential. So basically you get what is right for you. I am a more graphically inclined person, basically modelling, rendering, graphics etc.. so that is why I chose TV3D. Because it suits my needs better, and does the job for me. |
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seppuku arts
Community Member
Posts: 49
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« Reply #16 on: October 30, 2006, 11:54:31 AM » |
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DBP is capable of commercial quality, heck one of the community members did his final degree project on DBP showing how a low budget piece of game software is capable of making a commercial FPS, and has been used commercially. But you're right in the sense there are the better alternatives for commercial works, its just a great starting tool and TV3D for me, has been the next step from DBP. I mean I use DBP, TV3D, just started with Irrlicht and have Torque, I hope I can use all of them to develop my game making knowledge, I mean DBP is quite introductory, TV3D is good for working with C# to get the structure in a C language more, Irrlicht gets you started in C++ game making and more experienced for learning torque which is c-like scripting with it source in C++. I'll be really honest, if you say that is supposed to be a high poly model, at about 1.5k or more, it shouldn't be. The model isn't that high quality, almost no detail, you could reduce the amount of poly's by quite a bit and keep the same look. It would also help in your FPS count, considering that you say you have average/low hardware. Most of it is the head, those screenies are the best for showing the quality of the models, I didn't put in random polies or use smoothing. This should demonstrate the model better.   Although I do believe my texturing skills let it down.
Ouch, and the FPS is in the 20's? What hardware is this run on?
1.5ghz P4 256mb ram (I only ever seem to get 50 mb ram spare when my computer is running, although I have done as much as I can to optimise it) 256mb ATI Radeon 9550 40 gb HD with 2gb left To be honest I've never had a good gaming experience on this computer, even after Windows has been reinstalled, it just isn't the best for performance. I'm gionna bag ir soon and get a new one anyway. |
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Red Ocktober
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« Reply #17 on: August 29, 2007, 09:59:43 PM » |
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there's more... but i'm sorry... i'd never consider starting a game project in DBPro...
i really tried to like it, but it's not for me...
i have to bite my tongue... i am considering using the DBPro GDK (c++)... right now i'm just testing the shader waters...   so far, shaders are still a bit of a pain (mainly my fault cause i lack shader coding skillz at the moment) ... realtime shadows seem to work ok... getting just under 60 fps in the above scenes, but not much happening in em though... just simple scenes... the thing that did it for me was the GDK and accessing the api in c++... i need OOP.. --Mike |
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newborn
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« Reply #18 on: August 30, 2007, 07:42:03 AM » |
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just so you know, tv3d also has build in water which does the exact same thing as the post above
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cactus3d
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« Reply #19 on: August 30, 2007, 08:55:31 AM » |
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There is also a free customable shader for water done by a comunity member...
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